Doctor Treating Pregnant Women With Experimental Drug To Prevent Lesbianism

What you say about having it all reminds me of the quote about a society's worth being judgeable by how well it treats its most vulnerable members. It's not just what rules there are in place to protect these people, it's what other people are willing to do above and beyond what the rules say because they think it's the decent thing to do. If you're not in a favoured group, good luck getting some of that decency, if you even get all that you're owed by the rules.

ZoZo wrote:

C. Re: male suicides. Suicide attempts are distributed evenly. Men are just more successful at getting it to take.

Bingo. Men tend to use methods that have a higher "success" rate, so to speak. Guns and the like. Women, statistically, go for less violent methods like pills that can be reversed if caught in time by someone else.

Cyberwulf wrote:

Jay - I'm not sure if radical feminism has ties to Marxism. I think class is used rather than gender to acknowledge that people are oppressed based on other criteria too.

A few sociologists do tinker with gender and Marxism; a male friend of mine works almost exclusively in with Marxism and feminism.

And the guilt bit is a very valid point--my mother went back to work when I was in junior high, and she always felt bad about it, that she wasn't around all the time for my brother and I. Her folks didn't help much; my grandfather was always asking why she needed to be working and wasn't she spending too much time away from the kids? She was, at that time, working between part- and full-time at just one job, but no one was asking that same question of my dad, who was working three jobs at the time (one full-time+overtime position, one part-time, and a third whenever he was needed to teach).

lemmingwriter wrote:

ZoZo wrote:

C. Re: male suicides. Suicide attempts are distributed evenly. Men are just more successful at getting it to take.

Bingo. Men tend to use methods that have a higher "success" rate, so to speak. Guns and the like. Women, statistically, go for less violent methods like pills that can be reversed if caught in time by someone else.

You use that word and I get cross. Yes, 56% of men use firearms and 40% of women use poison, but it's not enough to account for the huge (and growing) gap between the numbers of men and women killing themselves.

Cyberwulf wrote:

so-called blue collar trades (plumbing, electricity, auto-repair, construction) tend to be overwhelmingly populated by men, and a university or college education is not always necessary for those kinds of careers.

Blue collar trades have been declining for a while, while white collar has been rising. And white collar workers earn on average 50% more per hour.

Cyberwulf wrote:

I can't speak for the States, but here it's still very much the custom for the eldest (or favourite) son to inherit the family farm. So there's at least one extra career path for men that tends to be closed to women.

And that goes double for agriculture. It's also more dead-end and cyclical than a cubicle job, your back just hurts more. It's hard for me to imagine anyone bemoaning the loss of that career path, the alternatives are being a doctor, scientist or engineer.

Sutremaine wrote:

Ooh ooh ooh, is it because they're passed over in favour of the new boy who's showing promise and needs a leg up? Repeatedly? How about not getting the little favours and bits of wheel grease that their male colleagues do? The isolation that comes with not being one of the boys, and the smaller social / job-related network that results from that?

Sorry to interrupt your little thing there, but real wages for men are falling and real wages for women are rising. Numbers of women managers are rising.

...What am I doing?

Honestly, I think men and women have it about equal in today's society.

....

*ducks*

SlyChild wrote:

Honestly, I think men and women have it about equal in today's society.

....

*ducks*

Uhh. Why do you think that.

Psy-4 wrote:

Sorry to interrupt your little thing there, but real wages for men are falling and real wages for women are rising. Numbers of women managers are rising.

Are they equal yet?

Alex89 wrote:

When did eugenics become trendy again?

Oh, people have been entertaining fantasies about eugenics for a long time now. Surely you've heard someone say that you should need a license to reproduce at some point in your life.

Sutremaine wrote:

Psy-4 wrote:

Sorry to interrupt your little thing there, but real wages for men are falling and real wages for women are rising. Numbers of women managers are rising.

Are they equal yet?

Who cares if they're equal? Numbers of women managers are rising! That means there's no such thing as patriarchy and never was. The reason rape conviction rates are so low is because women enjoy lying to cops to get good men in trouble. Judges award custody to mothers because of feminism. If single mothers are demonised for popping out kids for fabulous cash prizes, that's because it's what they do. Besides, they chose to have those babies when they could have just had an abortion. Provided those baby-killing bitches consulted the man involved first, of course. The narrow beauty standard is because men are Visual Creatures, proved by evolutionary psychology which is a completely valid field and not at all made-up bullshit that inevitably reinforces the status quo. It's just coincidence that when a couple have kids the mother invariably sacrifices her career and does most of the day-to-day work of childrearing. Everyone knows she's just waiting to divorce her husband and live high on the hog with all his money. Prostitution and stripping are empowering for women. Women aren't labelled as either virgins or sluts; they're just supposed to not sleep around but put out like crazy for whatever guy wants to hook up with them. And if they're not prepared to put out, why are they in that place dressed that way? Jeez, mixed messages much?

I'm so glad Psy-4 was here to open my eyes to the total non-existence of patriarchy. Now I can give up this feminism gig and go back to smiling coyly and nodding in agreement while Men are Talking. Maybe I'll put my energy into agitating on behalf of the poor men who are being crushed by the matriarchal juggernaught of bitchly evil.

Cyberwulf wrote:

I'm so glad Psy-4 was here to open my eyes to the total non-existence of patriarchy. Now I can give up this feminism gig and go back to smiling coyly and nodding in agreement while Men are Talking. Maybe I'll put my energy into agitating on behalf of the poor men who are being crushed by the matriarchal juggernaught of bitchly evil.

It's true! I'm going to advocate on the behalf of the poor oppressed men. Perhaps I shall do it by making sandwiches.

Sarcasm, bile, lack of understanding, demonisation and exaggeration of the opposition. You even arbitrarily threw in amateur skepticism of an entire scientific field, which I never intended to bring up. All because I brought up an opposing view and evidence for it.

Welp, I sure am impressed with that level of maturity.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I have a gravy train of male privilege to catch.

Psy-4 wrote:

Sarcasm, bile, lack of understanding, demonisation and exaggeration of the opposition. You even arbitrarily threw in amateur skepticism of an entire scientific field, which I never intended to bring up.

y u so mad bb? I'm agreeing with you! Patriarchy doesn't exist and never did! Women managers prove it!

Quote :

All because I brought up an opposing view and evidence for it.

What, the evidence I totally demolished?

Quote :

Welp, I sure am impressed with that level of maturity.

Why are you on a forum devoted to making fun of fanfiction written by thirteen year olds, again?

Quote :

Now, if you'll excuse me, I have a gravy train of male privilege to catch.

Must be nice to be able to walk around on a hot day like this with your shirt off and not have a horde of leering perverts wolf-whistle at you. Sure wish I could do that.

Cyberwulf wrote:

What, the evidence I totally demolished?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Psy-4 wrote:

Cyberwulf wrote:

What, the evidence I totally demolished?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

The old me would demand a detailed rebuttal (or even links to your original claims, which you neglected to provide), but now that I know patriarchy isn't real and never existed in the first place, I'm free to start campaigning for the rights of men not to pay child support if they don't feel like it.

I have a totally honest question for Psy. Where exactly was she exaggerating?

Hey Psy, you didn't answer my question. Are men and women equal when it comes to wages and managerial positions?

Sutremaine wrote:

Hey Psy, you didn't answer my question. Are men and women equal when it comes to wages and managerial positions?

Take your factual commentary away. It has no place here.

Psy-4 wrote:

Cyberwulf wrote:

Now I can give up this feminism gig and go back to smiling coyly and nodding in agreement while Men are Talking. Maybe I'll put my energy into agitating on behalf of the poor men who are being crushed by the matriarchal juggernaught of bitchly evil.

Not really an exaggeration. You apparently have not spent enough time with Whipped Husbands/Boyfriends, Men With Women Bosses, Men Who Know Feminazis, the Love Shy guys... hell there are guys that have no category that still feel their oppression by the hands of those evil women who are starting to assert themselves over what was once their domain. God forbid. Men that don't acknowledge, refuse to or just even honestly don't see how much better they actually have it than us. So, you may not like HOW she's saying it, but she isn't making this shit up or making it sound worse than it is. Guess why you can't see that? Hint: It's not the answer you think I'm thinking.

Psy sees nothing past the internet and "LOL FUNNY" in big red letters.

Jesus. wrote:

Cyberwulf wrote:

Now I can give up this feminism gig and go back to smiling coyly and nodding in agreement while Men are Talking. Maybe I'll put my energy into agitating on behalf of the poor men who are being crushed by the matriarchal juggernaught of bitchly evil.

Not really an exaggeration.

...Well, what did I expect by responding, besides dumb arguing? Unfortunately, that blurb is preceded by

Cyberwulf wrote:

I'm so glad Psy-4 was here to open my eyes to the total non-existence of patriarchy.

So, yes, it is an exaggeration of my opinions. It is obvious I want feminists to pack their bags and go home, because patriarchy is no longer in session. And since patriarchy is out, I obviously think that we now live in the opposite extreme of matriarchy.

Sutremaine wrote:

Hey Psy, you didn't answer my question. Are men and women equal when it comes to wages and managerial positions?

Uh-huh, what are the chances you will simply latch on to me saying 'No' and completely ignore the 'but if the trend continues, you will see it in your lifetime'?

Psy-4 wrote:

Sutremaine wrote:

Hey Psy, you didn't answer my question. Are men and women equal when it comes to wages and managerial positions?

Uh-huh, what are the chances you will simply latch on to me saying 'No' and completely ignore the 'but if the trend continues, you will see it in your lifetime'?

If the trend continues. Look at the way that Roe vs. Wade has been enforced recently -- if the attitudes that lead to inequalities persist, then equal rights will always have to be fought for despite being an alleged right. It doesn't matter that wages for women are rising if people's fundamental opinions on women and work don't change, because the expectation that women should be the ones to make the job sacrifices will still be there. If a firm has an equal number of male and female managers and has to cut managerial jobs, what do you think the gender ratio will be like afterwards?

I think it's more likely that the pay and employment gap will close to a certain level and stay there. There won't be equal treatment for women, just a new and more acceptable standard of inequality.

Sutremaine wrote:

If the trend continues. Look at the way that Roe vs. Wade has been enforced recently -- if the attitudes that lead to inequalities persist, then equal rights will always have to be fought for despite being an alleged right. It doesn't matter that wages for women are rising if people's fundamental opinions on women and work don't change, because the expectation that women should be the ones to make the job sacrifices will still be there.

Oh boo hoo. So your children, or, at worst, your grandkids will see it. Because the 18-29 age group is the most accepting and liberal one, and the older generations are the ones that hold the fundamental opinions and expectations. All of which will stop on the account of them being dead. You're just whining that the inevitability isn't coming fast enough.

Sutremaine wrote:

If a firm has an equal number of male and female managers and has to cut managerial jobs, what do you think the gender ratio will be like afterwards?

Oh, you seem to be very fond of >implying that women will obviously get the ax first, because they are women, but let's see some actual headlines in relation to jobs and layoffs this recession has brought us.

More Women Than Men Keeping Jobs
As Layoffs Surge, Women May Pass Men in Job Force
Recession hitting men harder
Losing jobs in unequal numbers
Men Suffer Brunt of Job Losses in Recession

Oh shit, WHAT A TWEEST.

Another point for my theory that this universe is directed by M.Night Shyamalan.

Sutremaine wrote:

I think it's more likely that the pay and employment gap will close to a certain level and stay there. There won't be equal treatment for women, just a new and more acceptable standard of inequality.

Do... do you relish being the victim? Because that will soon turn into victim complex.