lady forced out of charity work aw fuckit just read the link

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Hard to know what to do with old clothes and toasters in this season of shedding now that Vinnies has gone hardline Catholic. Those of us who thought the shop up the road was all about helping the poor stand corrected. "The primary function of the society," said St Vincent de Paul's lawyers, "is to inculcate the Catholic faith in its members."

This was rotten news for Linda Walsh. A rather fragile woman with a history of depressive illness, Walsh threw herself so enthusiastically into the work of the society that after six years she was running three committees around Brisbane and Vinnies was asking her to focus her volunteer efforts on just one. She choose to remain president of the Migrants and Refugees Logan Centre. She said: "It was my reason to get up in the morning."

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In January 2004 an ultimatum was delivered by the society's diocesan president for Gold Coast, Peter Richards. She had until June to become a Catholic, resign her position or leave the society. She was stunned. Richards said words to the effect that this "did not come from him but from above and he was just the messenger".

At emergency meetings over the next few days, he was asked to point to the rule that senior office holders in Vinnies had to be Catholic. He couldn't.

Over the next couple of weeks Walsh was forbidden to speak at a regional council meeting; furniture stored at her house for refugees was taken away; and she was promised an investigation into her treatment but nothing happened.

idk what st vinnies is but i am guessing it is sort of like a salvation army???

anyhow discuss

SirDixonDongs wrote:

anyhow discuss

I'm glad they have sufficient volunteers champing at the bit to spend their spare time doing good works to be able to throw away help offered. They're obviously in a different world to the one I'm in, where volunteer committees take whoever turns up regardless of ability in order to keep running.

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In January 2004 an ultimatum was delivered by the society's diocesan president for Gold Coast, Peter Richards. She had until June to become a Catholic

You know, I'm kind of amazed that the Catholic Church (or this little portion of it, anyway) still hasn't learned by now that you can't force a person to follow a particular faith through external pressure.

Lexin wrote:

I'm glad they have sufficient volunteers champing at the bit to spend their spare time doing good works to be able to throw away help offered. They're obviously in a different world to the one I'm in, where volunteer committees take whoever turns up regardless of ability in order to keep running.

You're assuming the primary purpose of this "charity" organization is to help people. Like Scientology "helpers", the point is to show what good people Catholics are so you'll want to repay their kindness by joining their faith. I could go on about how this makes me feel, but comparing them to Scientology makes my point well enough.

Well they won't be getting any more of my money.

(by which I mean the next time I feel like putting change into a box at the till it'll go in a different box)

TheHermit wrote:

You're assuming the primary purpose of this "charity" organization is to help people. Like Scientology "helpers", the point is to show what good people Catholics are so you'll want to repay their kindness by joining their faith. I could go on about how this makes me feel, but comparing them to Scientology makes my point well enough.

This is true, I stand corrected.

My concern about the (UK) government's willingness to pass the operation of welfare services to the so-called "third sector" is tripled.

Cyberwulf wrote:

Well they won't be getting any more of my money.

And people wonder why I won't give money to any organisation connected to organised religion - I have an annual argument at the door on the subject from the bloke from Christian Aid.

Lexin wrote:

My concern about the (UK) government's willingness to pass the operation of welfare services to the so-called "third sector" is tripled.

They're not seriously considering dismantling social welfare and forcing people to rely on handouts from volunteer groups?!

WTF is up with your new government, folks? First it's anonymity for rapists and now this?

Cyberwulf wrote:

Lexin wrote:

My concern about the (UK) government's willingness to pass the operation of welfare services to the so-called "third sector" is tripled.

They're not seriously considering dismantling social welfare and forcing people to rely on handouts from volunteer groups?!

Yes, but they share that with the previous bunch of bastards. So we're not getting anything new there: this lot are just planning to move faster.

Lexin wrote:

Cyberwulf wrote:

Lexin wrote:

My concern about the (UK) government's willingness to pass the operation of welfare services to the so-called "third sector" is tripled.

They're not seriously considering dismantling social welfare and forcing people to rely on handouts from volunteer groups?!

Yes, but they share that with the previous bunch of bastards. So we're not getting anything new there: this lot are just planning to move faster.

You know what's always fun? Watching a lolbertarian going from "TAXES ARE RAPE AND SLAVERY HOW DARE ANYONE TAKE ANY OF MY MONEY" to "THERE'S NO NEED FOR SOCIAL WELFARE BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE JUST THAT GENEROUS"

Cyberwulf wrote:

You know what's always fun? Watching a lolbertarian going from "TAXES ARE RAPE AND SLAVERY HOW DARE ANYONE TAKE ANY OF MY MONEY" to "THERE'S NO NEED FOR SOCIAL WELFARE BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE JUST THAT GENEROUS"

Have you heard of the [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Basically, it's overarching belief is that those who owe taxes should damn well get on and pay them, and in the UK there's about £100bn of uncollected, evaded and avoided taxes.

When I had the temerity to comment on this on my LJ, the two people who objected to my raising it were the two I believe are paid the most of all my LJ friends. Imagine my cynicism. And it's the same with libertarians - obviously the poor should be shafted, but if you say that they should pay the taxes that already exist, you can hear the howls across three fields and a spinney.

Yes, St Vinnies is pretty much like another version the Salvos here. I really had no idea the Catholic church ran it though. I'm not so surprised on how they've treated her, however - I've heard stuff like this way too many times.

Lexin wrote:

it's the same with libertarians - obviously the poor should be shafted,

Nono, it's not even that - the ones I've encountered have actually said "If people didn't have to pay taxes, they'd give the extra money to charity". ACTUALLY SAID THAT WITH STRAIGHT FACES.

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but if you say that they should pay the taxes that already exist, you can hear the howls across three fields and a spinney.

I KNOW! I'm like "YOU RESENT HELPING POOR PEOPLE NOW YOU SURE AS FUCK AREN'T GOING TO GIVE YOUR PRECIOUS MONEY TO CHARITY". Shit if the social welfare system here was abolished I'd take my grandfather in and support him myself rather than leave him dependent on the kindness of strangers.

Oh but best of all was one a friend of mine encountered who was all "if we abolished government the citizens would form groups to run communities by themselves" UMMM LIKE A GOVERNMENT???

ilu cy

Cyberwulf wrote:

Oh but best of all was one a friend of mine encountered who was all "if we abolished government the citizens would form groups to run communities by themselves" UMMM LIKE A GOVERNMENT???

Like they did before there was government... Like a government, but more dishonest, qv the Roman state - nepotism, anyone?

[quote="Cyberwulf"]

Lexin wrote:

it's the same with libertarians - obviously the poor should be shafted,

Nono, it's not even that - the ones I've encountered have actually said "If people didn't have to pay taxes, they'd give the extra money to charity". ACTUALLY SAID THAT WITH STRAIGHT FACES.
[quote]

I can quite seriously say that I wouldn't. I know me. I'm a selfish little brat and the gov't needs to be taking my money because otherwise I wouldn't give a dime.

Is a maaaan not entitled to the sweat of his brow?

This pretty much sucks to the extreme. Actually by doing things like this, the Catholic Church will end up with less members instead of more because nobody will want to join a religion that treats people like that. As already stated, you can't force anyone to believe anything by applying external pressure because beliefs are a private matter. I'd say that the behaviour of these particular Catholics is very UN-Christian... driving people away from the Gospel by acting like an ass... if that isn't already a sin, it should be.

Penguin wrote:

Is a maaaan not entitled to the sweat of his brow?

His sweat, yes. His money, not so much.

Lady Anne wrote:

Penguin wrote:

Is a maaaan not entitled to the sweat of his brow?

His sweat, yes. His money, not so much.

"NOOO," says the Lady in the land of fruits and nuts. "It belongs to the poor!"

Believe it or not, I don't mind taxes as long as they benefit we the people (yes, that includes welfare, food stamps, etc.) When the money goes to benefit they the corporations, however...fuck that.

Lady Anne wrote:

Believe it or not, I don't mind taxes as long as they benefit we the people (yes, that includes welfare, food stamps, etc.) When the money goes to benefit they the corporations, however...fuck that.

because corporations are just giant blobs of protoplasm and don't consist of "we the people" at all.

Princess wrote:

Lady Anne wrote:

Believe it or not, I don't mind taxes as long as they benefit we the people (yes, that includes welfare, food stamps, etc.) When the money goes to benefit they the corporations, however...fuck that.

because corporations are just giant blobs of protoplasm and don't consist of "we the people" at all.

generally they consist of one fat white guy in a fancy suit with an ugly tie running the show doing everything for his own benefit

Lady Anne wrote:

Believe it or not, I don't mind taxes as long as they benefit we the people (yes, that includes welfare, food stamps, etc.) When the money goes to benefit they the corporations, however...fuck that.

I'm more bothered that corporations don't pay the taxes they should. Which so many of them don't.

SirDixonDongs wrote:

Princess wrote:

Lady Anne wrote:

Believe it or not, I don't mind taxes as long as they benefit we the people (yes, that includes welfare, food stamps, etc.) When the money goes to benefit they the corporations, however...fuck that.

because corporations are just giant blobs of protoplasm and don't consist of "we the people" at all.

generally they consist of one fat white guy in a fancy suit with an ugly tie running the show doing everything for his own benefit

1. Corportations employ people. You honestly can't deny that.
2. So "fat white guy(s) in fancy suit(s) with ugly tie(s)" aren't part of "We the people" any more? Who's next on your "Not sufficently LiberalAmerican" list?

Lexin wrote:

I'm more bothered that corporations don't pay the taxes they should. Which so many of them don't.

This is a logical point. Dongs. you bastard, you could learn a lot from her. You won't, but you should