Israel Attacks Unarmed Humanitarian Ship in International Waters.

Let me try

wow that shit really won't link.

Malganis wrote:

I... consider myself a libertarian on most issues.

lol talk about your easy targets

Quote :

I'd respect them if they were willing to go the route of Gandhi for their beliefs.

Gandhi's non-violence only worked because the British Empire relied on a clean public image; citizens of the British Empire believed their overseas operations were humane and just. Gandhi's master plan was to reveal this public image as a sham, causing internal strife and international outrage. He understood exactly what he could and could not get away with, and clearly understood his own victory conditions. Israel, by contrast, doesn't give a flying shit what anyone thinks of them because the countries around them aren't going to retaliate to anything less than a full-scale invasion (Israel's got nukes) and the UN is incapable of delivering any form of justice (US has veto power, cutting any kind of punishment in the jugular). A significant portion of Israel's own people believe Palestinians are sub-human and deserve everything that is happening to them, so appealing to their sense of morality is also a lost cause. The Gandhi route wouldn't work for the Palestinians.

gaijinguy wrote:

I think it's the parentheses.

I've had this happen on other forums using this same software: it absolutely is the parentheses.

Cyberwulf wrote:

Malganis wrote:

Never said that civilian casualties don't happen over there to the Palestinians,

Then stop acting like the Israelis are fucking saints.

I... uh, haven't, so I'm unclear as to why you think I am.

Cyberwulf wrote:

This blockade that's hurting the ordinary Palestinians living there, what's that? Are you saying collateral damage is acceptable? 'Cos you know, terrorists often decide that collateral damage is acceptable too.

Didn't say it was. I'm just saying that since other posters have said the Israelis aren't 'helpless woobies that just need love', the Palestinians aren't necessarily the woobies here. I think that both sides have an incredible capacity to be wrong and to act wrongly here. It's not some whitewashed Pure Good versus Pure Evil for either side.

Cyber wrote:

Once again

Oh, when would that other time be?

Quote :

you're pontificating about something you don't know a damn thing about. You don't know thing one about terrorism, what causes it, or why ordinary people would support it, so shut your mouth.

No, I think I'm perfectly entitled to my opinion, just as you are. And frankly, no, I don't respect people who kill innocents to further their cause. If they sacrifice their own lives, peacefully, for what they believe, then that I respect. That takes courage.

Cyber wrote:

Quote :

Funny... some folks say that about the state of Israel, or just Jews in general.

And what does that have to do with anything? Israel gets a free pass to do whatever the hell it pleases because of the Holocaust?

No, just that it's out there, as gaijin said.

Obvious troll is obvious: A ship from the same group, the MV Rachel Corrie, is going to try and run the blockade. Apparently it's an Irish-flagged ship, though, and the Irish government has given Israel permission to intercept it.

Quote :

Former Assistant U.N. Secretary-General Denis Halliday, also aboard
the Rachel Corrie, said Thursday the passengers had no plans to confront
the Israelis. "We will stand back and show we are harmless and
unarmed -- we will put up no resistance," he said. "We're not going to
make any silly mistakes." Israel said its naval blockade is in
place to stop weaponry from reaching militants in Gaza intent on
attacking Israel. "If, as is their stated intention, the Israeli
government intercepts the Rachel Corrie, the government demands that it
demonstrate every restraint," said Martin. He called on Israel to lift
its blockade.

That ship is packed. It's a real crush on board.

I can't believe we actually support these people.

I know the Jews have had a bad time about history but I don't see what that has to do with getting away with all the shit they do.

Of course, it hasn't. The important part is that they're licking the US' arse and have nukes. Religion is irrellevant.

Penguin wrote:

Is this what you're referring to, or is there another source that could add some clarity?

First of all, if Israel were to attempt to justify their blockade under San Remo they would run into a slight problem - under that document general blockades against an entire population are illegal on-face.

Second, in order for San Remo to apply Israel would have to be in a state of war as defined by international law. Except for that to be true, Israel would have to acknowledge that 1) the Palestinian state exists, 2) that firing rockets into Israel from Gaza is not an illegitimate act of terrorism but rather a legitimate act of war and 3) would then have to treat any prisoners captured as POWs under the Geneva Convention.

Also, apperently it's not a war between Gaza and Israel, but an Israel occupation, so it's a whole different legal ball game.

And Israel is pissed that Turkey doesn't appreciate murder of its citizens.

Spotts1701 wrote:

Penguin wrote:

Is this what you're referring to, or is there another source that could add some clarity?

First of all, if Israel were to attempt to justify their blockade under San Remo they would run into a slight problem - under that document general blockades against an entire population are illegal on-face.

Second, in order for San Remo to apply Israel would have to be in a state of war as defined by international law. Except for that to be true, Israel would have to acknowledge that 1) the Palestinian state exists, 2) that firing rockets into Israel from Gaza is not an illegitimate act of terrorism but rather a legitimate act of war and 3) would then have to treat any prisoners captured as POWs under the Geneva Convention.

Thanks!