Night

Dû (Night) by dixiedream1n

Quote :

Ir Anor nutha vi'i 'welwen

When the sun nuthas in the air

Quote :

A calad pêl minna Annûn

and light of a fenced field enters West

Quote :

I 'welwen gala dûr

the air cultivates sombre

Quote :

An moelann môr

to a soft-space of darkness

Quote :

A sí dû onna

and now night begets

Quote :

I elen edelir

the star they-come-outward

Quote :

A síla galad tîn

and its radiance shines-white

Quote :

Sui tinui mîr

like silent is a treasure

Quote :

Nam menel

including heaven

Quote :

Dân ai, Ithil!

Greenelf, Oh! The Moon!

Quote :

Aidh calad celebren

Aidh of silver light

Quote :

Ui-lútha ind nín

ever-enchants my heart

Quote :

Call faen nedh hîth o dû

White Call in mist out of night

Quote :

A athan pan bain

and beyond beautiful all

Quote :

Ithil et-toltha nin

The moon fetches me outward

Quote :

I elen glir annen

the star of a song to water

Quote :

Denithon i tolth

I will dan the tolth

What it was supposed to be:

Quote :

When the sun sinks in the sky

And light fades into the west

The sky grows dark

To a velvet black

And here night is born

The stars come out

And shine their radiance

Like sparkling jewels

Upon high

But oh, the moon!

Whose silver light

Forever enchants my heart

A radiant beam in the mist of night

And fair beyond the rest

The moon calls me out

The stars sing to me

I will answer the call

Badfic writer, rhachon le!

As someone in the process of learning Sindarish, it's always interesting to see the ways in which people misuse it (I hope I didn't, in the last sentence). XD

You know that I wrote a textbook on Sindarin, right?

... you did make a few mistakes. "Rhach" is a noun, not a verb. A verb close to the desired meaning is "fuia-" - "to abhor/feel disgust at/loathe" "Le" would precede the verb. I'd translate it as, "Le fuion!" "I loathe you!"

I saw the title of this poem on the main page and thought that someone had written an Elie Wiesel fanfic.

I'm kind of curious about the difference betweeen 'night begets' and 'night is born'. Did the writer get the inflection wrong, or get the wrong word entirely, or both?

In Sindarin, because Elven gestation is one year long, there only is a verb for begetting. So, they got the inflection wrong. They needed the past participle, "onnen" - "begotten".

I_Lam_Edhellen wrote:

You know that I wrote a textbook on Sindarin, right?

... you did make a few mistakes. "Rhach" is a noun, not a verb. A verb close to the desired meaning is "fuia-" - "to abhor/feel disgust at/loathe" "Le" would precede the verb. I'd translate it as, "Le fuion!" "I loathe you!"

I do, and am using said textbook to learn. :D It's much better than the site I was using before. I was referring to the author of the fic/poem, not you (just to be clear, because I fear conflict >.>).

And thanks for the correction. I shall add it to my phrasebook.

Happenstance wrote:

I_Lam_Edhellen wrote:

You know that I wrote a textbook on Sindarin, right?

... you did make a few mistakes. "Rhach" is a noun, not a verb. A verb close to the desired meaning is "fuia-" - "to abhor/feel disgust at/loathe" "Le" would precede the verb. I'd translate it as, "Le fuion!" "I loathe you!"

I do, and am using said textbook to learn. :D It's much better than the site I was using before. I was referring to the author of the fic/poem, not you (just to be clear, because I fear conflict >.>).

Don't worry, I wasn't taking offense. Do I get three points if I figure out what website you were using before? Is it Arwen Undomiel, or one of her many clones? I got in a huge argument with her a while back over her deeply flawed phrasebook, namelists, and dictionary... I.E. she refused to actually learn Sindarin or Quenya, and just ransacked random sources (some good, some outdated, some wildly incorrect Neo-Elvish, and all of it mixed up together without any labeling.) So I went onto her forum, which had an Elvish-language section, and hung out there correcting the phrasebook translations and helping people with translation requests. She ended up IP banning me and putting up a new set of rules on her Elvish forum, a "no showing off" clause, just in case someone would actually try to help anyone with a translation.

Anyways, I am familiar with the malady that you suffer.

Happenstance wrote:

And thanks for the correction. I shall add it to my phrasebook.

Want me to go through this phrasebook and break down the phrases for you? (and find out if there are any more "rhachon le"s hanging around?)

Ah, it was indeed her. And now I realize the error of my ways. I shall have to go trolling on her forums now...:D

If I think of anything I need translated, I'll let you know. For now, however, I'll just stick to reading the textbook and learning grammar. XD I've always been wary of writing LOTR-themed stuff, because I'd want to use Elvish but wouldn't be sure whether the translations were correct...

Happenstance wrote:

Ah, it was indeed her. And now I realize the error of my ways. I shall have to go trolling on her forums now...:D

Don't bother. Her website is just about dead these days.

It's not your fault that you thought her website was legit. She puts a really sparkly shine to her Elvish section by having an interview with David Salo, the translator for the LotR Movies at the front of it, and the whining that she does about Grelvish makes it sound like she actually knows what she's talking about. That's why I hate her website more than I hate The Grey Company (creators of Grelvish). She lulls you into thinking she knows a thing or two about Tolkien's languages, and then hits you with a bunch of plagiarized crap. She's the original Sindarish translator.

Happenstance wrote:

If I think of anything I need translated, I'll let you know. For now, however, I'll just stick to reading the textbook and learning grammar. XD I've always been wary of writing LOTR-themed stuff, because I'd want to use Elvish but wouldn't be sure whether the translations were correct...

You wanna sign up for the class? Registration is still open. We'll be going through it together from mid-February to July. Having someone look over your shoulder and point out where you're going wrong is helpful, I think. My forums have several Elvish veterans on them, and you can always discuss it with the other students.

I_Lam_Edhellen wrote:

Happenstance wrote:

Ah, it was indeed her. And now I realize the error of my ways. I shall have to go trolling on her forums now...:D

Don't bother. Her website is just about dead these days.

It's not your fault that you thought her website was legit. She puts a really sparkly shine to her Elvish section by having an interview with David Salo, the translator for the LotR Movies at the front of it, and the whining that she does about Grelvish makes it sound like she actually knows what she's talking about. That's why I hate her website more than I hate The Grey Company (creators of Grelvish). She lulls you into thinking she knows a thing or two about Tolkien's languages, and then hits you with a bunch of plagiarized crap. She's the original Sindarish translator.

Happenstance wrote:

If I think of anything I need translated, I'll let you know. For now, however, I'll just stick to reading the textbook and learning grammar. XD I've always been wary of writing LOTR-themed stuff, because I'd want to use Elvish but wouldn't be sure whether the translations were correct...

You wanna sign up for the class? Registration is still open. We'll be going through it together from mid-February to July. Having someone look over your shoulder and point out where you're going wrong is helpful, I think. My forums have several Elvish veterans on them, and you can always discuss it with the other students.

Ugh, that's annoying. Instantly closed all my windows with her stuff open, and they will not be reopened. XD

I'd love to sign up for the class. :O I didn't know there was one. Where can I get details/register?

Happenstance wrote:

I'd love to sign up for the class. :O I didn't know there was one. Where can I get details/register?

It's called "Your Sindarin Textbook" and it's a branch of my Realelvish website. I'm just about done with the last bit of updates, and I'm running it through beta-testing now. (and re-writing a few homework assignments. Chapter 4's are a pain.) It's got links to mountains of interesting articles about Sindarin throughout it, which I think are a good read whilst waiting for the semester to start. Getting some more Tolkien books is a good idea too. You'll need The Lost Road and the War of the Jewels, as well as Parma Eldalamberon 17 and all of Vinyar Tengwar that you can get your hands on if you want to do any of your own research.

I_Lam_Edhellen wrote:

Happenstance wrote:

I'd love to sign up for the class. :O I didn't know there was one. Where can I get details/register?

It's called "Your Sindarin Textbook" and it's a branch of my Realelvish website. I'm just about done with the last bit of updates, and I'm running it through beta-testing now. (and re-writing a few homework assignments. Chapter 4's are a pain.) It's got links to mountains of interesting articles about Sindarin throughout it, which I think are a good read whilst waiting for the semester to start. Getting some more Tolkien books is a good idea too. You'll need The Lost Road and the War of the Jewels, as well as Parma Eldalamberon 17 and all of Vinyar Tengwar that you can get your hands on if you want to do any of your own research.

Ooh, shiny. :D
I shall be reading through this and registering for the forums and getting source materials and such. This is exciting.