The 21st Century Christians!

[Serious Announcer Voice]
And now it's time for... Church Chat.

[Fade in from black]

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Church Lady: Alright, alright. Now settle down, settle down. Alright, I'm the Church Lady and this is Church Chat! Well, there's been so much going on lately, so much going on, so let's [taps her index finger against the desk with each syllable] just get right to it, shall we? There's been a little movie out there, a little... thing called Star Wars...

[Audience claps]

Church Lady: Now, now, settle down, settle down! [fixes the audience with a stern look] Well, this star thing isn't just over the movies, but all over the television too, hmm... a little thing called Star Trek...

[Audience cheers and claps]

Church Lady: [nodding her head] Mmhm, that's right. Now... what we're going to discuss today is a little book about both of them, called--

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[The Church Lady holds up a copy of the book "Star Wars, Star Trek, and the 21st Century Christian, and examines it closely, adjusting her glasses.]

Church Lady: Hmm! What do we have here? Who's this handsome guy all in black? [She points to Darth Vader] Hmm... I think we've seen HIM before... dark overlord of the universe or... SATAN? We'll let you decide! Let's just read us a little excerpt here, shall we?


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Church Lady: Well, I hope it wasn't peeping in my windows!

[Audience laughs]


Church Lady: [Tapping her fingers on the desk] Well, now. Three Jezebels and a liar. And we all know who's a liar, don't we? Well, let's read a little more....


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Church Lady: Weeelll... isn't that speshul?


Church Lady: Hmm... I don't know. Who does he sound like?


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Church Lady: [looks at the audience] Well, that's just dirty talk! What a filthy little book we have here! Let's read some more, shall we?


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Church Lady: Hmm... could it be... I don't know... SATAN?!

Analogy FAIL. Apparently Satan has an even bigger bad guy as his boss, has a son, and turns on his boss to save his son. I don't remember that part from the Bible.

The really sad thing is that you could draw all sorts of parallels between Star Wars and Christianity that might actually work (the fall of the Jedi as Lucifer's rebellion, Darth Vader's redemption as a sign that everyone can be forgiven, etc.), but whoever wrote this book seems to have just gone for the superficial "Darth Vader is the bad guy, so he must be Satan, hurr durr".

Oh, it does get better in there. I'm only up to page 15.

Maybe the ancient Klingons had it right.

"Our gods are dead. Ancient Klingon warriors slew them a millenia ago. They were more trouble than they were worth."

In such stupidly vague terms, just about any piece of fiction that has a definite bad guy can be construed as Christian allegory.

Exodia's Right Leg wrote:

In such stupidly vague terms, just about any piece of fiction that has a definite bad guy can be construed as Christian allegory.

Unfortunately true. There was a kid in study hall, when my 9th grade literature class had to read Moby Dick, who spent a whole hour expounding on how Moby Dick actually symbolized Satan, and Ahab's trying to kill him was an attempt to escape going to Hell. I think I'm the one who pointed out to him that Moby Dick was a great WHITE whale, white being a color one normally doesn't associate with the Powers of Darkness, and he just looked smug and quoted a bible verse about Satan being able to disguise himself as anything he wanted.

God knows why I attracted these loonies.

Rabid Badger wrote:

Unfortunately true. There was a kid in study hall, when my 9th grade literature class had to read Moby Dick, who spent a whole hour expounding on how Moby Dick actually symbolized Satan, and Ahab's trying to kill him was an attempt to escape going to Hell. I think I'm the one who pointed out to him that Moby Dick was a great WHITE whale, white being a color one normally doesn't associate with the Powers of Darkness, and he just looked smug and quoted a bible verse about Satan being able to disguise himself as anything he wanted.

God knows why I attracted these loonies.

In fairness to your classmate, I can see that as a valid interpretation; the book does spend a whole chapter detailing why the color white is evil, after all.

On topic, that was hilarious. I always dislike it when people try to force religious allegory on whatever's popular at the time, whether it deserves it or not. Also, I was not aware Satan ever headed a galactic empire. You learn something every day.

Rabid Badger wrote:

There was a kid in study hall, when my 9th grade literature class had to read Moby Dick, who spent a whole hour expounding on how Moby Dick actually symbolized Satan, and Ahab's trying to kill him was an attempt to escape going to Hell.

So close, yet still so far. Moby Dick is a complex allegory for the struggle of humanity, but Ahab's seems to have embraced, rather than dominated, his darker impulses - only because whaling is 'harder' than drinking, gambling or chasing tail, that does not make it any less of an unhealthy obsession. It looks more to me like a chronicle of How One Ends up in Hell.

Quote :

I think I'm the one who pointed out to him that Moby Dick was a great
WHITE whale, white being a color one normally doesn't associate with the
Powers of Darkness, and he just looked smug and quoted a bible verse
about Satan being able to disguise himself as anything he wanted.

True, but whales are very dark and a black one would not stand out as much. IIRC there's something in the Bible about white skin as a form of divine punishment (not only leper at least). I'll have to check.

I wonder what your kid would have pulled out of Watership Down: the Exodus, perhaps? What would the rose in Le Petit Prince mean?

Spotts1701 wrote:

Maybe the ancient Klingons had it right.

"Our gods are dead. Ancient Klingon warriors slew them a millenia ago. They were more trouble than they were worth."

Given Roddenberrys utter hatred for Religion, is there any doubt that these "gods" were just some sort of advanced alien race? Do you really think Roddenberry would actually put true divine beings in his world?

Princess wrote:

Do you really think Roddenberry would actually put true divine beings in his world?

I have a question for you.
How many episodes did you not watch?

Keith Fraser wrote:

The really sad thing is that you could draw all sorts of parallels between Star Wars and Christianity that might actually work (the fall of the Jedi as Lucifer's rebellion, Darth Vader's redemption as a sign that everyone can be forgiven, etc.), but whoever wrote this book seems to have just gone for the superficial "Darth Vader is the bad guy, so he must be Satan, hurr durr".

If the devil has a sword fight against God before he gets thrown out of heaven and says, "thy powers are weak, old man." I'd read The Bible. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

The Unoriginal wrote:

Princess wrote:

Do you really think Roddenberry would actually put true divine beings in his world?

I have a question for you.
How many episodes did you not watch?

Pro-Tip: Deep Space Nine was after Roddenberry died.

Princess wrote:

The Unoriginal wrote:

Princess wrote:

Do you really think Roddenberry would actually put true divine beings in his world?

I have a question for you.
How many episodes did you not watch?

Pro-Tip: Deep Space Nine was after Roddenberry died.

What about Q?

Princess wrote:

Pro-Tip: Deep Space Nine was after Roddenberry died.

*HONK!* Try again.

Maximilia wrote:

What about Q?

*DING!*

Not sure Q qualifies, really. He's omnipotent, sure, but divine? That's got some other connotations that I think are missing.

PS: I enjoy Star Trek wank. Let's do this more often.

Princess wrote:

The Unoriginal wrote:

Princess wrote:

Do you really think Roddenberry would actually put true divine beings in his world?

I have a question for you.
How many episodes did you not watch?

Pro-Tip: Deep Space Nine was after Roddenberry died.

It aired after his death, yes. But he was aware of the concept, even though by the time the series was conceived his involvement in Star Trek as a whole was very minimal.

And frankly, Roddenberry had a lot of really screwball ideas. Opinions differ, but most agree that Gene Coon and D.C. Fontana were instrumental in keeping most of Roddenberry's off-the-wall ideas from materializing in the 1960's. You can see that in Seasons 1 and 2 of TNG, when he was essentially free of editors, the show was quite uneven in trying to be utopia.

Quote :

"Long, long ago, there was a Galactic Empire.
It was too, too real to be a nightmare. It existed, alright.
It was far, far bigger than you might imagine.

LONG AGO!? WELL, THE PAST HAS BECOME THE PRESENT, NOMADS! THE EVIL EMPIRE OF THE YANKEE DYNASTY REIGNS OVER ALL IT SEES WITH AN IRON FIST AND A LARGE PENIS WITH WHICH TO RAPE THE NONBELIEVERS!

QUAKE IN FEAR, MORTAL FOOLS, FOR THE SITH LORDS DARTH JETER, DARTH CANO, AND DARTH MO ARE COMING FOR YOU. LEADING THEM INTO BATTLE AND TO GLORIOUS VICTORY IS THE EMPEROR HIMSELF, DARTH GIRALDI. THESE DUKES OF DOMINANCE DEFINE UNDEFEATABLE. THESE ICONS OF INVINCIBILITY INCINERATE INFIDELS.

YOUR GODS CANNOT SAVE YOU FROM THE WRATH OF JOBA THE HEAT. HE IS THE BRIDGE FROM YOUR HOPE TO YOUR UTTER DESTRUCTION. FORSAKE YOUR MEANINGLESS WAYS AND GIVE YOURSELF TO THE DARK SIDE.

GIVE YOURSELF TO THE EMPIRE!

Satan gets redeemed at the end? It seems the lake of fire isn't all it was cracked up to be, after all.

Yay, Church Lady!

Maximilia wrote:

Oh, it does get better in there. I'm only up to page 15.

That little text took up fifteen pages? Seriously? [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]